Wednesday, May 28, 2008
Specter Demands Sanity Check on Obama's Hypocrisy
By Peter J. Wirs
"The Democrats begrudge the 2000 Bush-Gore Florida
recount. They blithely complain when Republicans seek
valid measures preventing voter fraud. Why then, are
the Democrats suddenly blind, deaf, and dumb when
Senator Barack Obama and the Democratic National
Committee openly avow to disenfranchise voters
1,749,920 in Florida and 594,398 in Michigan? Not only
are Obama and the DNC perpetrating a "hi-tech"
lynching, but it is blatantly unconstitutional and may
even be criminal."
...
"Several prominent civil rights attorneys, obviously
speaking off the record being mindful they’re
outsiders, nonetheless told us that the without
question, Democrats must fully seat the Florida and
Michigan delegations. (Their response was as if we
were asking a "no-brainer" akin to whether kids be
eating their vegetables). The universal consensus that
the possibility of embroiling the Democratic
presidential nominee in criminal proceedings in the
midst of a campaign unquestionably should not be a
risk worth entertaining."
http://www.townhall.com/Columnists/PeterJWirs/2008/05/28/specter_demands_sanity_check_on_obamas_hypocrisy


  Bob Clark

count the votes fair and honest and hillary is being kicked
to the curb before it's all even over. makes you wonder if
republicans want obama in so mccain will win because mccain will lose to hillary.

For the sake of our country and everything we stand for,
please count the votes of FL and MI.  Do not silence these people who did nothing wrong!

Dean seems loathe to comment on this question on the
record. I think we as Hillary supporters should
require of him than he does.

Hillary All The WAY

FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE HEADING TO DC ON MAY 31st...

 

I've created a bunch of products, the latest is the "Orange You Gonna Count My Vote" stuff  (partial proceeds go to HillaryClinton.com)

 

http://www.cafepress.com/gigglechick/5583928

 

 

here is other stuff:

 

http://www.cafepress.com/gigglechick/5112889

 

 

Best-

Gigglechick 

There should be a new primary for florida and michigan!

I sure hope they do count all the votes because if they
don't I will not vote for a democrat for the first time in thirty
years.I am fed up with this party.

We are at war because of other countries discriminating and
disinfranchising certain groups of opeople. Lead by example and count Florida and Michigan!!! We look like bullies telling others to become a democracy yet we are going to elect a President  without counting two states. It appears we are forgetting a few million people! Men are running thie show and if Hillary was a man, trust me these states
would be counted. Obama is cheating if he gets the nod without these votes being counted, play fair and may the most popular candidate win. One more thing , no one asked the people about the Michigan and Folorida decision....it is our job to elect the President.

ALL VOTES IN ALL 50 STATES MUST BE COUNTED. OUR FORE
FATHERS ARE NOT VERY HAPPY ABOUT THE CHEATING THAT HAS BEEN GOING ON IN THIS ELECTION.
HOWEVER THE REPUBLICANS ARE
ECSTATIC OVER THIS SITUATION AND PLEASE DON'T FORGET THE WORLD IS WATCHING.

If you want to "COUNT THE VOTES"....

Then tell Hillary to "COUNT THE VOTES" in the CACUS STATES as well!!

Oh wait... if she did that then Hillary wouldn't be able to reach him at all in the popular vote.

Maybe we should just stick to the BIASIS rules of Hillary "It's the
delegate count", "It's the Super Delegates", And now it's "The
Popular Vote" Clinton!

Movement March for Michigan and Florida

On August 26, 1920 Women Ended Their Suffrage & Won the Right to Vote...some of those women born before given the right to vote still live. They live in Florida; they live in Michigan; they live to have their voices heard before they no longer live...

"We march for those who cannot march for themselves. We march for those who have been... Punched when they're down, told to go home/quite, voices suppressed, betrayed by their peers, bullied out of their life's work; for those who are fighting for the weaker who have no voice, For those whose voices need to be heard, WE MARCH."
                                                       
In an effort to send a message to the DNC, this group of marchers intend to become a symbol for injustice in a Unified Front.

Why all the hubbub you ask?

Because on Saturday May 31st, the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee (RBC) will determine the status of MI and FL voters at an open meeting.
"As Democrats, the Party of the People, we stand for the principle that every vote must count. Consistent with this, we believe the DNC must seat the delegates selected by the Michigan and Florida voters," organizer chairman, Ricki Lieberman of New York.

The marchers believe that anything short of counting the votes and seating the delegates, as voted, is a violation of the fundamental civil rights and civil liberties of MI and FL voters, and an affront to us all.

"We must not allow this injustice to occur. Will the DNC party to do to itself what the Republicans did to the entire nation in 2000?
We must make all voices heard and all vote matter--we do so with this Movement March for Michigan and Florida on MAY 31...we do so as the rules committee begins their meetings at 9am,"states Ricki Lieberman, chairman of the group.

This march is sure to generate buzz as the organizers intend to send Bologna sandwiches to the DNC rules committee to let them know that not seating Michigan and Florida is Bologna. The marchers will also send Lemon-Aid to demonstrate the sour taste left in their mouths because of the injustice in Florida and Michigan. And, there are hints of parading a live donkey as a display of the A__ __ the DNC will be should they not seat those two states.

To Join in this history making event, or to find out more, visit www.floridademandsrepresentation.org or http://blog.enablemyself.com.

This is a real and genuine issue, but your your
thinly-veiled advocacy for Sen. Clinton rather than the good for the Democratic Party wreaks of hypocrisy and unfairness.  Sen. Clinton did not care last Fall when she was the anointed one and asserted on NH Public Radio that everyone knows the Michigan votes wouldn't be counted.  Then, when she starts losing, she changes her tune.  What a joke.  That said, some compromise should be reached to seat the delegates fairly.  However, not in the manner in which votes were cast in the faux elections, esp. Michigan where Obama got 0 votes. Sen. Clinton doesn't even want to grant him the uncommitted vote.  In short, stop trying to hoodwink people into thinking you truly care about democracy.

Please contact the military officers supporting Hillary
Gen.Clark etc. Caucus states deny military folks a vote! This adds to the pressure we can use to count all votes. Amendments stating caucuses deny workers, disabled, etc.  can be added now to platforms before the state conventions

Let's not have a repeat of the 2004 election.

The democrats can do what they like. In the November election I will write in Hillary's name. I'll get her into the game one way or
another. All of her supporters can do the same thing. She can't lose.

Do not throw you vote away in November write it in make it count for Hillary.

Any reason you only recently opened this site? Where were
you before Super Tuesday? Why weren't you jumping down Hillary's throat for agreeing that the Michigan and Florida results were "meaningless" back then? And what about the Caucus states? How do we calculate a "popular vote" for them and why do we consider Puerto Rico when they have no vote in the general election? I'm not happy with Florida and Michigan not being seated, but I'm not convinced either of the primaries is a valid representation of the voters as a whole.

Great idea!  Count Florida and Michigan vote w/o penalty. 
I find Howie Dean duplicit in denying Hillary her rightful popular
vote and delegate count from those 2 "naughty" states who suffer maximum penalities, while other states who moved up their primaries did not.  I have no doubt who gets Howie's superdel vote after it's all over.  Hillary supporters are NOT going to accept the results are fair unless and until the Florida and Michigan issue is settle fairly and BEFORE the 2,025 mark has been reached.  Does anyone believe that
if Obama reaches 2,025 by the time of the Oregon vote, the DNC Rules Committee will vote to raise the bar, fair as that would be?  I'm fully in support of your stance!

did clinton pledge not to have ML and FL voided. YES or NO.

Why keep changing the rules when you are losing. Obama has won in most states, most votes and pledged delegate. Clinton was not ready on day 1 thats why she lost. We need a President who is ready on day 1

From what I can tell, the national Democrats are not
denying Florida and Michigan the right to vote.  Their own
legislatures did.  They knew the rules and chose to ignore them.

The time to object was when the rules were made.  But, you didn't then, because you thought your candidate was a shoe-in.  Rules are not to be broken when its convenient.

Perhaps you should swallow some of your pride and support the party.

Greetings,

From blogs and general press, I understand that your group shares many of the values and concerns of a similar group I and a handful of Friends of Hillary in New York recently started, called the Ad Hoc Committee to Count Every Vote.

We are embarking on three major initiatives: (1) a letter writing campaign to Howard Dean, the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee and Super Delegates, (2) small rallies around the country in support of the principle that every vote must count and (3) a rally on May 31 outside the DNC RBC meeting in support of MI, FL and our cherished democratic principles.

Please let me know if you'd be interested in working together on any of these projects.  We are expecting hundreds and hopefully thousands of people to go to Washington for the Rally, and I'd love to add members of Count the Votes to our organization committee.

A little background about myself, I'm a partner at Kirkland & Ellis LLP, the international law firm and have been active in Democratic politics as a donor, volunteer and policy advisor for the past ten years.  I have been extremely active in Hillary's bid for the presidency.

I hope to hear from anyone at your organization soon.

Best wishes,

Binta N. Brown

from very first post:
"We also have to remember that Senator Obama's name wasn't even on the ballot in Michigan."

Oh yes it was, dear . . . until polls showed him losing by 20+
points, so he had it removed.

Annette invited you to "Count Every Vote Rally - DNC Rules & Bylaws Meeting on FL & MI" on Saturday, May 31 at 7:00am.

Event: Count Every Vote Rally - DNC Rules & Bylaws Meeting on FL & MI"Make sure that every voter in this election gets heard! "
What: Rally
Host: Count Every Vote Rally Steering Committee
When: Saturday, May 31 at 7:00am
Where: TBA

To see more details and RSVP, follow the link below:
http://www.facebook.com/p.php?i=717848424&k=Z2E263RYV2WM51CCYFYZTP

Everyone can join Facebook. To register, go to:
http://www.facebook.com/p.php?i=717848424&k=Z2E263RYV2WM51CCYFYZTP&r

Thanks,
The Facebook Team

SEXISM???!!! How dare you play that card Hillary? until we
stop acting like victims when its convenient for us we will continue to be second class citizens in this world.

This is the way it is. If the DNC doesn't count our votes
as they stand (not half) then what's going to happen (if Obama gets the nominee) the democrats of Florida will either NOT vote OR vote for McCain come Nov. I am one of those that will be voting for McCain if Obama gets the nod. There isn't any reason our votes shouldn't count. Besides Obama was in TAMPA when he wasn't supposed to be: here's proof -
http://www2.tbo.com/content/2007/sep/30/obama-vows-do-whats-right/?news-breakingyes he "apologized" but I franky am SICK of hearing his apologies. Thanks to all the democrats that set up this site.

I am glad to see this site!
I am so angry at the Dem party, I am going to write Hillary on my ballot in NOV.
The reps in MA will never get my vote again. They will be sorry for going against the voters.  We voted for Hillary in the primary and they back BO.  What are they drinking? They are not thinking. Shame on you guys!

They agreed in advance that the delegates would not be
seated, not that the votes would not count.
Obma removed his name by choice.

On Feb 20, Hillary Clinton said, "It's clear: This election
they're having is not going to count for anything. I personally did
not think it made any difference whether or not my name was on the ballot".

Clinton surrogates approved this penalty, along with the DNC, against Fl. and Mich.  Terry McAuliffe proposed a similar penalty years (50% representation) earlier when Michigan tried to buck DNC rules.

There's a lot of respect for Hillary among Democrats for all the work she has done the people in this country but... this type of
opportunism and double-talk is why so many people have such a high negative opinion of her.In the end, this type of hypocrisy degrades progressive causes and the accomplishments of both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama.

They agreed in advance that the delegates would not be
seated, not that the votes would not count.
Obama removed his name by choice.

I am on the verge of leaving the "Democratic" party as a
result of this mismanaged election. Citizens across this country are being misinformed and/or simply ignored. The media, pundits and politicos are consistently demonstrating more dictatorial than
democratic attitudes and behaviors. (Not to mention the "sweetie" dismissals or the "your vote doesn't count and your voice doesn't matter" quotes from Superdelegates. George Bush gave us of that for the last 8 years - enough already!  I'm ready to fight for HILLARY!, as she's fought for us!

Count the votes!  Absolutely crazy that anyone in this
country would need to make that argument!
I have stopped watching the "pundits."  They have lost all credibility.
Chattanooga
TN

The pledge that HRC signed said that she would not campaign
in FL and MI. it was not an agreement not to count the votes. the
famous quote that the obama campaign is using about hillary saying that MIs votes wont count is her saying that the DNC have said that they wont count them (theres a difference!)

those votes were legal and certified in official elections held by
the states. the DNC can choose not to seat the delegates, but the
votes count!as for obama not being on the ticket in MI, he took himself off the ballot as a political calculation. a strategy to pander to iowans and
so as not to lose an early primary. now he should pay the cost of his strategy in MI. he won IA, congratulations. he lost MI, that is a shame, but thats how it works. he should get no credit for popular vote (uncommitted doesnt equal obama) and he should get no pledged delegates from MI (thats the cost of taking your name off the ballot!)

If Obama were presidential material he would have stood up by now to say that in america we count all the votes. he would have said that he wouldnt want to be a 48-state nominee in the closest primary in our lifetimes. He would not allow the democratic party rules to override the fundamental democratic principle of counting all the votes. Sadly, he has done the exact opposite, and it will be a stain on the Democratic Party for many election cycles to come.

Thank you for this site, and for  continuing to speak out 
to the DNC on behalf of the voters in Michigan
                                                      and Florida. Your work 
makes me proud to call myself an American!!

I live in the Boston area (North Shore) and am glad to see you work toward getting the votes in Michigan and Florida counted. I voted for Senator Clinton in our primaries, and would like her to become the Democratic Nominee for President. Thank you for your efforts.

Let me know how I can help.
-Sundar

Thank you for starting this badly needed website.  I will
help you in any way I can.  Senator Clinton is my hero. And, I
believe that she will be the greatest President our country has ever
had.

As a FL Democrat, I'm really over not having my vote count!
Bad enough the Repubs do it, but et tu, DNC? Bet they'll want my vote come November.,  Lynda Hollywood FL

I would like to help also.  Please let me know how. A
Democratic Women for Hillary against the no vote in Michigan anFlorida. I've already sent a donation now I'd like to send my voice to the DNC and Bylaws Committe or help where I can.

        Sandra Crowley,
        Waltham, MA.

I applaud your website for its enthusiasms and energy.
However, we have to remember that both Clinton and Obama, as well as leaders in the DNC agreed ---in advance--- that they would abide by the rules that said that FL and MI votes would not be counted if they 'jumped the gun'..which they did. We also have to remember that Senator Obama's name wasn't even on the ballot in Michigan.   

Well if the DNC had any good sense they would see that
without Hillary Clinton, most of the hard working middle class will
either not vote or vote for McCain.  They should come to their
sense's and do the right thing.  Vote Hillary all the way!!!!!!!!

Dear DNC, Pelosi, Superdelegates, Ted Kennedy and the Elite.

Stop manipulating this selection process.
Americans are tired of your continued attempts from the beginning to hand this nomination over to Obama.

If the nomination is given to Obama without all 50 states being
counted FIRST and without anyone receiving the 2209 delegates needed we are going to send a loud message to you in November!

This is an important election and the unfairness and sexism displayed by the good old boy network of Washington is appalling.

The facts are that neither candidate will receive the 2209 needed and millions of Americans want them to proceed to the Convention and make their case to the Delegates according to the rules and the Democratic process.

Once the Convention Delegates decide then the results will be accepted by all.

Any further manipulation and pre-mature crowning of Obama as the nominee will be seen as a FRAUD and an illegal  Democratic Nominee!!

"Rule is Rule" is a fascist and totalitarian doctrine. It
is a crime against humanity to deny a people the right to participate in the governing process of their country. Note also that  there is an existing right to vote, DNC cannot overrule that right. Well, the people of M/F overruled DNC and their choice must be respected. period. "Once any form of government because destructive of democratic ends it is the right it is the duty of the people to alter or to abolish it..." that is the norm, that is the principle of international law and constitutional law. It is not just morality in action it is sovereignty of the people in action and be you so high the sovereign law is above you.

I'm in the Boston area and would love to help.  I am SO on board with women making an issue out of this disgraceful primary season.

However, your website's a bit of an embarrassment.  I mean, there's  no names connected to the commentary so it's very difficult at first  to tell that the comments were all made by different people.

I could go on, but I won't...especially since it's not an area I can 
actually help with!!

Anyway...contact me and let me know what needs doing!

Robyn Miller
Quincy MA

The concept of ex post facto is enshrined as a guiding
principle in our Constitution. To ignore the DNC ruling and count
Florida and Michigan's votes as cast would fly in the face of this
concept. It would stand as an insult to every other state and
territory that obeyed the rules. It is also a slight against all the
candidates, including those no longer in the race, because it
undermines the campaigns they ran in accordance with the rules.

I wholly agree that some compromise must be reached, and the Florida and Michigan delegates must eventually be seated with votes. However, I do not see how anyone can in good conscience argue that the existing vote should stand as is. It's an affront to the party, the Constitution, and the notion of fairness that this country is founded on.

I wanted to express my appreciation of the letter your organization sent to Dr. Dean on May 14, 2008.  The text of this letter was provided in the comments section on the overnight thread at www.taylormarsh.com.  I have been deeply troubled by the apparent bias of many of the media and the Party leaders during this primary season.  Please add my information to your contact data base:
 
Sharon van Kooten
1803 W 750 S
Trafalgar, IN  46181
sharonvk@embarqmail.com
 
I strongly believe that in such a close election, the voices and will of the voters is much more important than that of the main stream media and Party leaders.   The consistent calls for Senator Clinton to drop out of the race should be viewed as a potential voter suppression campaign, and I fully support any effort to chastise the media for their interference.
 
Additionally, I don't understand why so many Party leaders want to circumvent the prescribed nomination process.  As far as I'm aware, a nominee is not truly legitimate until the convention is held.  The calls for Senator Clinton to drop out appear to be not only unprecedented, but also at odds with the established nomination procedures.
 

Thanks for the laugh! There's nothing more predictable and amusingthan feigned political outrage.  I'll be laughing even harder whenObama seats the MI/FL delegations after Hillary drops out. And it'sall thanks to your heroic and completely uncontrived efforts to makesure their votes count, you tireless warriors for democracy. Thanksfor all that you do!
By the way:
You've inspired me to change my email signature to the following:
"It's clear: This election they're having is not going to count for anything."-Hillary Clinton, sounding like a thuggish third world dictator whileadvocating strongly and clearly for the disenfranchisement of Michiganvoters. Of course this was long before she was desperate for delegates- which, by the way, don't matter - because the real metric (thisweek) is the popular vote. And if that doesn't work out for her, thenew metric for deciding the nomination will be Obama's votepercentages in selected Appalachian counties where at least 75% of thepopulation has not completed high school.

I've never seen or heard anything rude, arrogant or devious
come out of Hillary's mouth.  I can only speculate that men fear her strength and courage.  It speaks more of those men than of her, when they spout such blind hate.

I am a 77 year old Dutchman and follow your elections
daily,Americans liberated Holland in 1945 but you need to liberated now because this system(corrupt)from not counting these 2 states is not very Democratic. USA and Europe need a strong leader this time and that is Hillary !!

The Smart Choice!
Hillary is the 'smart' choice. What's wrong with Americans?
I do wonder this. Those people that voted for Obama BEFORE we knew about him...would they still do it?"

People still vote for Clintons when they know all about them.  What
can you say?

I promise you that if Obama is the Democratic nominee I will
have no trouble voting for Mc Cain as there is something very flawed about Obama and the way that women have been treated in this primary, also I find the statement the Israel infects our foriegn policy to be frankly scary. This person should never be allowed to be president. I will NOT VOTE FOR HIM nor will I remain with a party who does not show any leadership by not renouncing the way Senator Clinton has been treated as a woman. PERIOD!

All,
I want to help somehow. I DO NOT in any way shape for form support Obama and will NOT  hear me NOT vote for him in the GE. What can I do to make my voice heard? Also what the DNC has done to Flordia and Michigan is the same as shoving a candidate down my throat and they will not get my vote or my support EVER again if they sit by and do not do the right thing.
Sincerely,
Dawn Button
Woman first, American second and Democratc not for long.

I cannot believe the democratic party will truly remain at
odds with each other and will shoot itself in the foot YET AGAIN. 
Great sportsmanship.  If the shoe had been on the other foot and
Obama had lost, I do not think there would be such a hue and cry. 
Isn't it if it isn't MY way, it's the highway?  What about the
issues?  Doesn't that count at all.  He ran a better smarter campaign
than she did.  He did not lie about Bosnia; he did not pander about
the gas tax.  He did not recall the faint stigma of bigotry to get
votes.  He ran an above-board campaign.  Do you hate him because you love her? When are you going to realize that the most important thing is a change from the terrible policies that have driven us close to bankruptcy in this country, and in a war we can't possibly win
because five minutes later they will be fighting amongst themselves
as they have been for hundreds of years.  Elaine LaMagna

"It's clear: This election they're having is not going to count for anything. I personally did not think it made any difference whether or not my name was on the ballot," Clinton told NPR.

I live in Fl and will write my reps and Senators.
Please continue to work to count the votes and put me on your email  list.

Thanks
Madelyn Bryson
Florida

All the democratic candidates agreed that the votes in
Florida & Michigan would not be counted.....GROW UP! & LIVE BY THE RULES!!!!!

If you want to count the votes then shouldn't we count
EVERYONE'S vote?  Obama wasn't even on the ballot in Michigan.  The only way the votes should be counted is if there is another primary with ALL the candidates on the ballot.

This country needs Hillary This Democratic Party needs
change not the country.  I'm so disgusted I will switch

I would like to join your organization.
 
Additionally, I live in Arizona and would definitely like to challenge the super delegates in my state to make sure they remain true to Hillary.
 
Please respond to:  versaillesxiv@yahoo.com
 
Thank you.
 
Judie Mollètté, MA. MHRM. MMKT.

Hello all,

As a MA dem I am proud of the power of your voices. I am with you. HillaryClinton is the best choice for our nation, and she is my only candidate. Ihave limited time and money, but I am strongly willing to do whatever I canin support of you!

Thank you so much for representing my voice, and the voices of so many others.

With gratitude,
Neila Hingorani
Milton MA 02186

Anyone who calls HRC a liar doesn't know her and hasn't
listened to her. She is the smartest, most honest and trustworthy
candidate we've had in generations. I listened to her yesterday
talking to the farmers of SD...she understands and is compassionate and will get us out of Iraq, keep our nation safe and restore a healthy economy. There is no other choice for President. Hillary is the best

I will absolutely not vote for someone who has not been
correctly vetted. Why should we vote for an unknown? McCain has at least been a man who goes to his own drumbeat. Obama is virtually
without much substance when it comes to his short lived time in the senate.

Hillary is the 'smart' choice. What's wrong with Americans?
I do wonder this. Those people that voted for Obama BEFORE we knew about him...would they still do it?

The headlines for the past few days have reflected Senator
Clinton's win in West Virginia, expected...no big deal...who
cares....Obama has still won the nomination...it doesn't matter.
It does matter! Several of the states Obama has "won" Clinton came in close within a percentage of the vote. Clinton has been hugely victorious in all of the large states that carry the most weight in the general election throughout her entire campaign. The media and the Obama camp need to recognize this!!!!To consistently downplay her huge victories in those states and to ignore the people of Florida and Michigan is going to be the DNC's downfall this year.
It was disheartening to see that though millions of people went out to vote for HRC in West Virginia leading to her victorious outcome are being ignored...Obama conceded even before the votes were counted and continued to campaign elsewhere as if West Virginia voters do not matter....he has done this in several states where HRC has been victorious.
He does not care about who the voters want. This is evidenced by his very actions! Let the voters of this wonderful country be recognized if not heard or counted!!
I have been democrat for the past fifteen years and the discourtesy and negligence on the part of the DNC and the "superdelegates" in this nation (not to mention the biased media) have turned a nation of
voters sour indeed!

I am disturbed and disgusted with my party and cannot help but to think two things:
With all of Obama's money from thugs, ringleaders, and special
interest groups he has bought each and every superdelegate that has endorsed him with cash and bribes (including Edwards with the Vice-president position).
The men of the DNC and the many male superdelegates are threatened and intimidated with the thought of a female president and will do anything, literally anything to make sure that a woman does not ever get voted into that position!

This truly is disturbing. Hillary I don't know if you read these
blogs, but it is my hope and many other's as well that if Obama does buy the nomination you should run as an independent or better yet establish a huge underground nationwide network for voters to write your name in on the ballots during the general election.Quite frankly if you are not nominated and decide not to run Independent my family, friends and I are still planning to write your name in!

Even if our votes are not recognized, heard, or counted we will
remain true to the end!!!!!

So what happens when you count all the votes (including FL
and MI), all the pledged delegates, and all the contests won and
Obama is still ahead, as he is now?  Then do you get behind the 
nomination of Barack Obama?

Or, do you throw and immature tantrum and vote for war, the rich, and
corporate interests in John McCain?

Nader voters are more respectable.

With all due respect, Florida and Michigan did this to
themselves. In fact, Florida was offered BONUS delegates if it would move its primary back. The state's legislature refused and the DNC simply did what it warned it would do.

I know that you feel like your candidate has no chance without these votes -- and even with them her chances are nil -- but what's fair is fair. Forty eight states played by the rules. Two did not. How do you reward them that?

It's NOT about women in general (see: Condi Rice, Elizabeth Dole, Laura Bush, etc.) = EFFECTIVE women leaders
 
It's about THAT woman in particular; or THAT PERSON in particular: She's an unabashed liar.
 
If women are SO desperate to have one of their gender get elected that they are willing to sacrifice their integrity, then America has already gone to hell.
 
Vote for the Libertarian then.

Let the votes be counted. Obama blocked re-vote efforts in
both states. He is now campaigning in MI and FL wanting their votes in the fall after essentially saying their votes counted for nothing in the primary. Audacious!

Counting the votes would be equally unfair since not
everyone voted in FL and the candidates didn't campaign in FL, and only Hillary was on the ballot in MI. An equitable solution can
probably be found, with effort, but simply "counting the votes" as
they stand is not it. EVERYONE INVOLVED knew and agreed in advance that any state that moved their primaries up would suffer this fate. Now they want to change the rules. That's not fair play either.

Isn't it difficult to count the votes of an election that
included only one candidate?

By what stretch of the imagination is that fair or democratic?

I'll consider joining if you can explain. Clinton advisors were on the rules committe that voted to sanction the two states. Now, they are changing their mind:

"Ickes explained that his different position essentially is due to the different hats he wears as both a DNC member and a Clinton adviser in charge of delegate counting. Clinton won the primary vote in Michigan and Florida, and now she wants those votes to count.

"There's been no change," Ickes said. "I was not acting as an agent of Mrs. Clinton. We had promulgated rules and those rules said the timing provision ... provides for certain sanctions, automatic sanctions as a matter of fact, if a state such as Michigan or Florida violates those timing provisions."

"With respect to the stripping, I voted as a member of the Democratic National Committee. Those were our rules and I felt I had an obligation to enforce them," he said.

Clinton won after all the Democratic candidates agreed not to campaign in either state because they violated the party rules. "


I am a 48 year old women, and I would consider joining, but address this first.

It's over.  If you want to take your toys and go home after
Obama is nominated, then you might as well go vote for the crazy old warmonger.  You know, the one who needs "Bomb-Iran" Lieberman to whisper the difference between Sunnis and Shia in his ear.  Enough. 
Fla. and Michigan broke DNC rules, end of story. Their voters can
waste their votes on "sending a message", or they can stand behind our party's nominee. All the Hillary supporters I know (many in my family) would rather walk on hot coals than vote for John McCain. Enough already.  End of story.

Funny how Clinton and her supporters never advocated for
all the votes being counted BEFORE the election results of MI and FL.  I'm confident the DNC rules and bylaws committee will come up with a reasonable way to assign delegates which is fair (and partial to Clinton which she doesn't deserve).

Despite the wording of your home page, the direction of
your interest is pretty transparent.  If you're really that concerned about the voters in Michigan and Florida, where was your activism last fall -- before all Democratic candidates committed to supporting the DNC's decision?  And what are the ramifications of your exemption-because-one-candidate-wants it-that-way approach for future elections?

I can sympathize with your concerns.  I really can!  But it just
comes across as more than a little hypocritical and self-serving to
be pressing for this at this point.  This effort, well-intentioned
though it surely is, seems to flaunt the decision that the DNC and
all candidates made last fall, as well as the decision that must be
made now taking in mind precedents for future elections.

I agree the votes need to be counted but fairly.  We cannot
let the Michigan January vote stand as is, which seems to be the only scenario Clinton will accept.  Biden, Edwards, Obama, and Richardson all took their names off of the Michigan ballot.  Clinton and Dodd were the only ones on the ballot.  Is it a fair vote when voters can't vote for their preferred candidate?  Is it a fair vote when many just stayed home because their candidate wasn't on the ballot?  Michigan Democrats proposed a 69/59 delegate split in Clinton's favor early this month but she rejected it.

If she really cared about all 50 states, she wouldn't have said in an interview with George Stephanopoulos on 12-30-07 that it will be over by Feb. 5th.  (see youtube keywords 'Clinton' 'february 5th')  Obama is winning precisely because he has had a 50-state strategy.  Its why he campaigned in states like mine, Utah, that Democrats usually don't care about.  Its why hes won 28 out of 44 states that have voted thus far.  Hillary was running for president for all the states up until Feb. 5th, thinking she was a shoe-in.  That's why she's losing.

I find this web site objectionable because it was Jenn
Granholm who decided to push the Mich.primary up, knowing and ignoring the clear rules laid down by the DNC, and the consequences of breaking them. If the women behind this web site are angry that Michigan and Florida votes will not be counted, I have three questions for them that I would like them to answer on this website:
First, did they make any effort to pressure the FEMALE Governor of Michigan to not move the primary up, and did they pressure Hillary to not let her name be on the ballot.
Second, before the primaries did they pressure the DNC to change it's rule that the primarys in those two states would not count.Third, If the positions were reversed and Hillary's name was not on the ballot, and Obama's name was, and he "won" those states, would they agree that it is outrageous to try to change the rules after the game has been played.

They aren't going to reward two states who didn't follow
the rules.  Each candidate is on the record (and youtube) saying they know these elections wouldn't count.  They will be punished for going early otherwise the other 48 states would be upset.

Sorry, but there are no votes to count! Those states broke
DNC rules, knowing what the consequences would be. Had the candidates actually campaigned despite the sanctions, it would be different.
However, Mr. Obama abided by the agreement, so must not be punished for doing so. The proffered settlement in Michigan was turned down by Clinton's campaign - she can't have it both ways, either agree to a settlement that does not advantage her or don't count them, one or the other!

If Florida and Michigan are to be counted, then hold redo
primaries.  As it stands, neither were fair and all candidates agreed
beforehand that they are invalid.  Hold valid primaries in order to
have a voice in this Democratic Nomination.  It would also help to
have followed to the rules in the beginning, FLORIDA and MICHIGAN
(especially YOU Florida!  Get your act together with elections!
Honestly!).

Yes!!  I am so pleased to find this website!  This is
important for the Democratic party to hear and understand our
frustration....

Thanks so much for this website.  The democratic primary as played out is a raw deal for Hillary Clinton and I’m glad this website has the guts to tell it like it is.  I am so angry at the media and the whole stilted process.

Alison Ford

I can't believe that the Democrat Party has done this too Hillary Clinton!  They are costing her the nomination and my belief in the party.  I will not support or vote for Obama and I want the MEN on that committee held responsible for this debacle.  I have not seen anything that makes me believe that votes in Florida an Michigan won't change the outcome of the nomination.  Can the women of this party not do something about this?  I'm from Arkansas and not always proud of it, but I've always liked Hillary's  spirit of audacity.  I've been so incensed by this mess that I think I'll have a stroke if something isn't done to make it right.  I'm sick to death of the way men handle our nations problems and I want to see her get a shot at turning this country around.  I've waited all of my life for this election and I don't want the rug pulled out from under her just because we want to act like doormats.
   No one in the Democratic Party is going to "make me" suck it up and like it either.